18th centry music - Minstrel Banjo2024-03-29T11:07:54Zhttp://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/forum/topics/18th-centry-music?commentId=2477478%3AComment%3A13270&xg_source=msg_com_forum&feed=yes&xn_auth=noCarl- LOL!
(Sorry, just stu…tag:minstrelbanjo.ning.com,2013-07-16:2477478:Comment:959842013-07-16T15:47:25.677ZStrumeliahttp://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/profile/Strumelia
<p>Carl- LOL!</p>
<p>(Sorry, just stumbled upon this old post and almost spit my coffee out...lol lol)</p>
<p><br></br> <br></br> <cite>Carl Anderton said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/forum/topics/18th-centry-music?commentId=2477478%3AComment%3A13372#2477478Comment13354"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><cite>Mary Z. Cox said:…</cite></div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p>Carl- LOL!</p>
<p>(Sorry, just stumbled upon this old post and almost spit my coffee out...lol lol)</p>
<p><br/> <br/> <cite>Carl Anderton said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/forum/topics/18th-centry-music?commentId=2477478%3AComment%3A13372#2477478Comment13354"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><cite>Mary Z. Cox said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/forum/topics/18th-centry-music?commentId=2477478%3AComment%3A13347&xg_source=activity#2477478Comment13347"><div><p style="text-align: left;"><img alt="" src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/3129089957?profile=original"/></p>
We think there is a good chance that we were the above two in a previous life and the banjo player wanted to come back as a blonde this century and we both wanted some really nice drums and banjos to take our sound forward in more interesting times. :)</div>
</blockquote>
<br/> <strong>If you two really are re-incarnated slaves, the membership here would be fascinated to hear what banjo music actually sounded like in "less interesting times."</strong></div>
</div>
</blockquote> More Familiar Tunes from Rile…tag:minstrelbanjo.ning.com,2010-01-07:2477478:Comment:133722010-01-07T02:07:32.000ZBrent W Browninghttp://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/profile/BrentWBrowning
More Familiar Tunes from Riley's<br />
<br />
Here are some more familiar tunes found in the Riley's index on colonial music website.<br />
<br />
Robinson Crusoe Mrs. McLeod The Dusty Miller Speed the Plow Comin' Thro' the Rye<br />
<br />
Spanish Fandango Mrs. Migillicuddy The Highland Laddie College Hornpipe Gilder Roy<br />
<br />
Flowers of Edinburgh Rakes of Mallow Adeste Fideles Anacreon in Heaven (Star Spangled Banner )<br />
ie…
More Familiar Tunes from Riley's<br />
<br />
Here are some more familiar tunes found in the Riley's index on colonial music website.<br />
<br />
Robinson Crusoe Mrs. McLeod The Dusty Miller Speed the Plow Comin' Thro' the Rye<br />
<br />
Spanish Fandango Mrs. Migillicuddy The Highland Laddie College Hornpipe Gilder Roy<br />
<br />
Flowers of Edinburgh Rakes of Mallow Adeste Fideles Anacreon in Heaven (Star Spangled Banner )<br />
ie<blockquote cite="http://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/forum/topics/18th-centry-music?xg_source=activity&id=2477478%3ATopic%3A13140&page=2#2477478Comment13274"><div>Thanks Ian for your comments. Rougues March was also used in the US Army for punishment. Other tunes that were duty calls were Peas on a Trencher and Molly Put the Kettle On. Depending on how many former military men you had living in your community,they might have been popular or NOT popular since military service was not necessarily an honorable thing but often a desperate measure of last resort when you couldn't find any other work in those times. Follow the link I posted earlier for a list of tunes from Riley's.<br/> <br/>
<cite>Ian Bell said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/forum/topics/18th-centry-music?commentId=2477478%3AComment%3A13270&xg_source=msg_com_forum#2477478Comment13270"><div>This has already been addressed by Brent's interesting note about the Riley Flute book, (I'd love to see that sometime) but, as an unrepentant tune-hound I can't resist throwing in my two cents worth.<br/> A number of the tunes in the old banjo books are Scots/Irish fiddle tunes that were popular in the 18th century on both sides of the ocean, although I suspect that it may not have occurred to anyone - black or white - to play them on the banjo in that era. Most of these tunes are still part of living fiddle traditions where I live (in Ontario) today.<br/> They include:<br/>
Monymusk (aka Darkey Money Musk in Briggs)<br/>
Fisher's Hornpipe (aka Darkey Fishers Hornpipe in Briggs)<br/>
Bottle of Brandy (is called Bully For You in Converse '65)<br/>
Highland Fling (Monymusk again - under an alias in Winner's '83)<br/>
Robinson Crusoe or Rogues March (winner's '83)<br/>
The above is a real Rev. War tune - The British army at least, used this tune for drumming soldiers to punishment - the melody was later co-opted for an early 19th music hall song about "Poor old Robinson Crusoe"</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote> Mary Z. Cox said:
We think th…tag:minstrelbanjo.ning.com,2010-01-05:2477478:Comment:133542010-01-05T00:51:17.000ZCarl Andertonhttp://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/profile/CarlAnderton
<cite>Mary Z. Cox said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/forum/topics/18th-centry-music?commentId=2477478%3AComment%3A13347&xg_source=activity#2477478Comment13347"><div><p style="TEXT-ALIGN: left"><img alt="" src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/3129089957?profile=original"></img></p>
We think there is a good chance that we were the above two in a previous life and the banjo player wanted to come back as a blonde this century and we both wanted some really nice drums and banjos to take our sound forward in more interesting times.…</div>
</blockquote>
<cite>Mary Z. Cox said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/forum/topics/18th-centry-music?commentId=2477478%3AComment%3A13347&xg_source=activity#2477478Comment13347"><div><p style="TEXT-ALIGN: left"><img alt="" src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/3129089957?profile=original"/></p>
We think there is a good chance that we were the above two in a previous life and the banjo player wanted to come back as a blonde this century and we both wanted some really nice drums and banjos to take our sound forward in more interesting times. :)</div>
</blockquote>
<br />
If you two really are re-incarnated slaves, the membership here would be fascinated to hear what banjo music actually sounded like in "less interesting times." Here is a corner of a painti…tag:minstrelbanjo.ning.com,2010-01-04:2477478:Comment:133472010-01-04T23:42:42.000ZMary Z. Coxhttp://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/profile/MaryZCox
<p style="text-align: left;"><img alt="" src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/3129089957?profile=original"></img></p>
Here is a corner of a painting called "The Old Plantation." It is from the 1700s and it looks very much like these gentleman are playing some dance music on banjo and drums.<br />
<br />
Here is a pix of Yazid and I who also play dance music on banjo and drums. We think there is a good chance that we were the above two in a previous life and the banjo player wanted to come back as a blonde this century and we both wanted some really nice drums and banjos to take…
<p style="text-align: left;"><img src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/3129089957?profile=original" alt=""/></p>
Here is a corner of a painting called "The Old Plantation." It is from the 1700s and it looks very much like these gentleman are playing some dance music on banjo and drums.<br />
<br />
Here is a pix of Yazid and I who also play dance music on banjo and drums. We think there is a good chance that we were the above two in a previous life and the banjo player wanted to come back as a blonde this century and we both wanted some really nice drums and banjos to take our sound forward in more interesting times. :)<br />
<p style="text-align: left;"><img src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/3129090143?profile=original" alt=""/></p>
<br />
Our "Drumming on the Edge of Banjo" Cd will be coming out soon and there is at least one colonial fiddle tune as many Celtic traditional tunes that folks playing the banjo in the 1700s would have probably heard and longed to play as soon as they had nice instruments. :) Thanks Ian for your comments.…tag:minstrelbanjo.ning.com,2010-01-03:2477478:Comment:132742010-01-03T13:50:22.000ZBrent W Browninghttp://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/profile/BrentWBrowning
Thanks Ian for your comments. Rougues March was also used in the US Army for punishment. Other tunes that were duty calls were Peas on a Trencher and Molly Put the Kettle On. Depending on how many former military men you had living in your community,they might have been popular or NOT popular since military service was not necessarily an honorable thing but often a desperate measure of last resort when you couldn't find any other work in those times. Follow the link I posted earlier for a list…
Thanks Ian for your comments. Rougues March was also used in the US Army for punishment. Other tunes that were duty calls were Peas on a Trencher and Molly Put the Kettle On. Depending on how many former military men you had living in your community,they might have been popular or NOT popular since military service was not necessarily an honorable thing but often a desperate measure of last resort when you couldn't find any other work in those times. Follow the link I posted earlier for a list of tunes from Riley's.<br />
<br />
<cite>Ian Bell said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/forum/topics/18th-centry-music?commentId=2477478%3AComment%3A13270&xg_source=msg_com_forum#2477478Comment13270"><div>This has already been addressed by Brent's interesting note about the Riley Flute book, (I'd love to see that sometime) but, as an unrepentant tune-hound I can't resist throwing in my two cents worth.<br/> A number of the tunes in the old banjo books are Scots/Irish fiddle tunes that were popular in the 18th century on both sides of the ocean, although I suspect that it may not have occurred to anyone - black or white - to play them on the banjo in that era. Most of these tunes are still part of living fiddle traditions where I live (in Ontario) today.<br/>
They include:<br/>
Monymusk (aka Darkey Money Musk in Briggs)<br/>
Fisher's Hornpipe (aka Darkey Fishers Hornpipe in Briggs)<br/>
Bottle of Brandy (is called Bully For You in Converse '65)<br/>
Highland Fling (Monymusk again - under an alias in Winner's '83)<br/>
Robinson Crusoe or Rogues March (winner's '83)<br/>
The above is a real Rev. War tune - The British army at least, used this tune for drumming soldiers to punishment - the melody was later co-opted for an early 19th music hall song about "Poor old Robinson Crusoe"</div>
</blockquote> Our forefathers came from a v…tag:minstrelbanjo.ning.com,2010-01-03:2477478:Comment:132722010-01-03T07:03:42.000ZPaul Certohttp://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/profile/PaulCerto
Our forefathers came from a variety of countries, and brought with them the songs they sang before their journeys began. As an example, Money Musk is an Americanization of the town of Mony Musk, Scotland. Many old songs would have come here. The Streets Of Laredo is a variant of an old English song, The Dying Rake. I believe several of our late 19th century cowboy songs originated as sea chanteys in the British Isles. Tracing which songs are "period correct" isn't too hard. Proving that some of…
Our forefathers came from a variety of countries, and brought with them the songs they sang before their journeys began. As an example, Money Musk is an Americanization of the town of Mony Musk, Scotland. Many old songs would have come here. The Streets Of Laredo is a variant of an old English song, The Dying Rake. I believe several of our late 19th century cowboy songs originated as sea chanteys in the British Isles. Tracing which songs are "period correct" isn't too hard. Proving that some of them were played on banjoes may be difficult-if we choose to let that be a stumbling block. It seems to me that as songs were picked up by slaves and freed slaves, they would have played songs they heard around them. It is likely that at least some slave musicians would have been pressed into service to play for dances on the plantations they worked on, and perhaps were encouraged to learn songs that were favorites of the master & his family. Some of these old songs are actually still in the folk traditions, such as The Young Man Who Wouldn't Hoe Corn, and The Devil & The Farmer's Wife. Many of the ballads collected by Cecil Sharpe and Francis Child date back at least a few hundred years, and are still in the repertoire of singers such as Jean Ritchie. They may well have evolved from their 15th or 16th century forms.<br />
It was the two World Wars and the coming of radio, modern roads, and automobiles that really made changes. My wife recalls older folks in her family speaking a version of English long forgotten in big cities. It was more modern than the King James Bible, but on that line. She's only 57, (don't tell her I gave out her age!),these old timers were still alive in the late '50's & early '60's. It may be that stroke style is the earliest banjo style we can document, primarily through the tutors of the mid 19th century, but we can use that as a starting point. And try to trace what can be traced. This has already been address…tag:minstrelbanjo.ning.com,2010-01-03:2477478:Comment:132702010-01-03T04:37:41.000ZIan Bellhttp://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/profile/IanBell
This has already been addressed by Brent's interesting note about the Riley Flute book, (I'd love to see that sometime) but, as an unrepentant tune-hound I can't resist throwing in my two cents worth.<br />
A number of the tunes in the old banjo books are Scots/Irish fiddle tunes that were popular in the 18th century on both sides of the ocean, although I suspect that it may not have occurred to anyone - black or white - to play them on the banjo in that era. Most of these tunes are still part of…
This has already been addressed by Brent's interesting note about the Riley Flute book, (I'd love to see that sometime) but, as an unrepentant tune-hound I can't resist throwing in my two cents worth.<br />
A number of the tunes in the old banjo books are Scots/Irish fiddle tunes that were popular in the 18th century on both sides of the ocean, although I suspect that it may not have occurred to anyone - black or white - to play them on the banjo in that era. Most of these tunes are still part of living fiddle traditions where I live (in Ontario) today.<br />
They include:<br />
Monymusk (aka Darkey Money Musk in Briggs)<br />
Fisher's Hornpipe (aka Darkey Fishers Hornpipe in Briggs)<br />
Bottle of Brandy (is called Bully For You in Converse '65)<br />
Highland Fling (Monymusk again - under an alias in Winner's '83)<br />
Robinson Crusoe or Rogues March (winner's '83)<br />
The above is a real Rev. War tune - The British army at least, used this tune for drumming soldiers to punishment - the melody was later co-opted for an early 19th music hall song about "Poor old Robinson Crusoe" Just click on the "100" on pa…tag:minstrelbanjo.ning.com,2009-12-31:2477478:Comment:132302009-12-31T17:00:01.000ZBrent W Browninghttp://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/profile/BrentWBrowning
Just click on the "100" on pages to get a list of the songs in Rileys
Just click on the "100" on pages to get a list of the songs in Rileys http://www.colonialdancing.or…tag:minstrelbanjo.ning.com,2009-12-31:2477478:Comment:132292009-12-31T16:50:57.000ZBrent W Browninghttp://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/profile/BrentWBrowning
<a href="http://www.colonialdancing.org/Easmes/Biblio/B042437.htm" target="_blank">http://www.colonialdancing.org/Easmes/Biblio/B042437.htm</a><br />
Just click on the 100 across from pages to get a list of the tunes in Rileys.<br />
<cite>Brent W Browning said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/forum/comment/show?id=2477478%3AComment%3A13228&xn_out=json&firstPage=1&lastPage=1&_=1262278133801&xg_token=75051cad4fc47a41e25fdf9256f51ac1#2477478Comment13228"><div>Riley's…</div>
</blockquote>
<a href="http://www.colonialdancing.org/Easmes/Biblio/B042437.htm" target="_blank">http://www.colonialdancing.org/Easmes/Biblio/B042437.htm</a><br />
Just click on the 100 across from pages to get a list of the tunes in Rileys.<br />
<cite>Brent W Browning said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/forum/comment/show?id=2477478%3AComment%3A13228&xn_out=json&firstPage=1&lastPage=1&_=1262278133801&xg_token=75051cad4fc47a41e25fdf9256f51ac1#2477478Comment13228"><div>Riley's Flute Melodies, reprint 1973, was a book of common songs that was printed in 1814 and reprinted in 1820. Some familiar tunes found in it include:
Money Musk<br />
Come Haste to the Wedding<br />
Irish Washerwoman<br />
St. Patrick's Day<br />
Fisher's Hornpipe<br />
Rickett's Hornpipe<br />
Durang's Hornpipe<br />
<br />
They all pretty much sound like the versions we know today as transcribed from Riley's. I used to play St. Patrick's day on the site's gourd banjo while on of the musician's played whistle when I worked at Historic Fort Snelling. You had to play the melodies pretty straight and only grab the 5th string if it was used as a melody note. None of this constantly on the 5th string that you hear today. It's only speculation on my part, but that may be why minstrel style is so sparing in it's use of the 5th string as a drone. You couldn't, if you wanted to play the popular music of the day.<br />
<br />
If you can share PDF files on this site, I'll scan some of the transcriptions I made from Riley's. If I recall correctly, most of the tunes were in D, which sets well on a banjo tuned GCGBD. St. Patrick's Day is very close to the version found in George Weilich's book. I'll also share a link to a list of the tune's in Rileys on the next post.</div>
</blockquote> Riley's Flute Melodies, repri…tag:minstrelbanjo.ning.com,2009-12-31:2477478:Comment:132282009-12-31T16:48:54.000ZBrent W Browninghttp://minstrelbanjo.ning.com/profile/BrentWBrowning
Riley's Flute Melodies, reprint 1973, was a book of common songs that was printed in 1814 and reprinted in 1820. Some familiar tunes found in it include:<br />
<br />
Money Musk<br />
Come Haste to the Wedding<br />
Irish Washerwoman<br />
St. Patrick's Day<br />
Fisher's Hornpipe<br />
Rickett's Hornpipe<br />
Durang's Hornpipe<br />
<br />
They all pretty much sound like the versions we know today as transcribed from Riley's. I used to play St. Patrick's day on the site's gourd banjo while on of the musician's played whistle when I worked at Historic…
Riley's Flute Melodies, reprint 1973, was a book of common songs that was printed in 1814 and reprinted in 1820. Some familiar tunes found in it include:<br />
<br />
Money Musk<br />
Come Haste to the Wedding<br />
Irish Washerwoman<br />
St. Patrick's Day<br />
Fisher's Hornpipe<br />
Rickett's Hornpipe<br />
Durang's Hornpipe<br />
<br />
They all pretty much sound like the versions we know today as transcribed from Riley's. I used to play St. Patrick's day on the site's gourd banjo while on of the musician's played whistle when I worked at Historic Fort Snelling. You had to play the melodies pretty straight and only grab the 5th string if it was used as a melody note. None of this constantly on the 5th string that you hear today. It's only speculation on my part, but that may be why minstrel style is so sparing in it's use of the 5th string as a drone. You couldn't, if you wanted to play the popular music of the day.<br />
<br />
If you can share PDF files on this site, I'll scan some of the transcriptions I made from Riley's. If I recall correctly, most of the tunes were in D, which sets well on a banjo tuned GCGBD. St. Patrick's Day is very close to the version found in George Weilich's book. I'll also share a link to a list of the tune's in Rileys on the next post.